Bert Martinez:
Welcome back, everybody. Today on the show, Norm Blumenthal. Norm Blumenthal is an attorney for workers and consumers. Selected as one of the top attorneys in Southern California, Norm was also inducted and recognized as one of America’s most trusted lawyers in employment law. Norm Blumenthal, welcome back.
Norm Blumenthal:
Nice to be back, Bert. You know, and question now for us is where do we go from here? Seems like every time we have an idea, it gets adopted somewhere. We just remember, I don’t know if you remember back, we had the idea of having school districts build housing for their teachers on the properties so that they have the teachers right there and they then they can afford the housing that they’ll be entitled to. And recently San Diego school board adopted that approach. So that was really a big win for teachers. And that, you know, don’t make the kind of money that other people do. They do it for the love of the job more than anything else. So it’s nice to see that.
And that, you know, dovetails into the next issue we have, which is the velocity of money. And you know, we’ve talked about this many times. And it’s the consumer is, you know, almost 70% of the gross domestic product in this country. So if you can’t get the consumer to spend, you’re not going to get the economy up and running to the point where we cover our debt. Right. And we have lower interest rates.
So right now, how do you get the consumer to stimulate how do you stimulate the consumer? And, you know, we had an idea a couple shows ago where if you allowed apartment owner with 10 units that he wanted to sell for a million dollars and had to recapture all of his deductions, it wouldn’t even be worth it for him to sell it for a million dollars because he would lose money. Right.
Wrote off all of the expenses, plus plus plus so, you know, we came up with the idea of having no tax on the the sale and allowing the owner to Instead of having 10 units and selling, advertising them for a million dollars for the whole package and you then be able to break it up and turn them into 10 condos at 100,000 each. And you pay no tax on the, on the gain or the income that you wrote off. And I just recently read that that’s something that the current administration is interested in.
So they floated out that idea that there’d be no capital gains tax. So that’s something good that we’ve talked about before. And I haven’t heard it anywhere until like when it was until it was repeated by the Administration. So we have to increase the velocity of money. This is the, where we have to go because I guess they had just Amazon prime and the sales were off by 40% and wow, people, that’s incredible.
Well, people aren’t spending. I think they, everybody’s nervous. I mean, they’re spending some money, but not a, you know, not the kind of spending that we’d like to see across the board. So these are ideas that if enacted, would stimulate spending. The other thing is to stimulate spending is to reduce the Fed fund rate. And you know, that’s been an issue that administration and, and Fed Chair Powell have gone back and forth on. It was interesting to note that for every 1% increase in the Fed fund rate, it cost the federal government $300 billion. For each 1%.
So if you bring it down 2%, that’s 600 billion that we would save in expense on the debt. And we have a lot of it, you know, we have $35 trillion in debt. And so that’s, so wait, wait, I.
Bert Martinez:
Want to get, make sure I got the math right. For every 1%, we’re looking at 300 billion.
Norm Blumenthal:
Right.
Bert Martinez:
That’s incredible.
Norm Blumenthal:
If you add, if you do the Math, Sure. What $35 trillion in debt. So if you take 35 trillion and 1% of, of, of a trillion is 100, 100 million, 100 billion. That’s the kind of numbers you’re talking about. So it’s $300 billion of savings. So this is something that, you know, it’s good. I think that the administration should continue to push for reduction in interest rates. And it goes across the board too, because then home loans are cheaper and people would be more inclined to spend and buy a house if they, if it was, you know, couple points less interest rate, I’d be way more attractive.
And then that’s the key, which is to increase the velocity of money. That is the, the secret sauce.
Bert Martinez:
Right? I mean, look, let’s just take the home purchase example. Somebody buys a home, even you know, they’re going to probably rent a moving truck or they’re going to hire a moving company. So again, that’s increasing local sales. Most new home buyers are going to replenish, I’m sorry, replace one or two or several pieces of furniture. So again, you got those sales. It’s, it’s a, it’s a win all the way around.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, this is you, you got to stimulate the economy. You need to get the consumer spending again. And I think that they’re, they’re all kind of leery everybody is on spending because one is the interest rate’s too high for them to afford it, and two is they don’t know where the economy is going. And I think you solve both problems. If you cut, cut rates a couple of points, you’ll save those problems because, and, and as you say, you’ll increase the velocity of money because everybody we’re talking about, they’re going to spend their dollars.
I mean, the millionaires and billionaires, they may be able to spend, but how many, you know, boats can you own? And so how many vacations can you take? How many planes can you own? So there’s a certain point in time where the, the top 1/10 of 1% is just, isn’t spending the money. And so the money gets tied up and it becomes in the hands of people that won’t spend. While a person buying a house or an apartment, kind of, you know, a condo, they’ll be spending, as you say, on all the things that go with that, you know, new carpet, new paint, cleanup, you know, but you need to, if you’re just building single family homes alone is just not going to do it right.
Bert Martinez:
And, and the thing about it is, again, guys, when Norm is talking about the velocity of money, it’s kind of think of it as a daisy chain or, or what do you call it? Anyway, that’s my thought. But you know, again, you walk into a store and let’s say you buy it, you know, you buy $1,000 worth of furniture or whatever. And so that keeps those people employed, those employees now can go and spend that money in the community. And so that’s the velocity of money. It’s just how quickly does that money go from one hand to the other? And so right now, because the economy is kind of in limbo, I don’t want to say in limbo, but the economy is certainly uncertain. So you’re, you’re seeing the slowdown not only in the velocity of money, and then that makes the economy slow down. People are concerned. You can, you can see the, you can see what’s happening in Wall Street.
Wall street reacts to consumer confidence. And so when consumer confidence is high, you’ll see the stock market high. When consumer confidence is low, stock market suffers. And as Norm just mentioned, you know, here’s, here’s Amazon during their last special prime day. They’re down 41, 41%. So it is, this is what’s, what our government, in my opinion’s, number one job, is to create jobs, help create jobs and keep the economy moving.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, And I, I think the administration is doing with the, it thinks is, is right. I mean, obviously we have, they’re putting more debt on, which is not a good thing. But in the long run, they have to have a sustainable economy for, for people to want to spend money. And you know, you’re not going to get the billionaires to spend because there’s a finite amount of things that toys that, and trips and that they can take and, and do so. But if in the middle class, that’s the sweet spot. And if you, there’s jobs, the unemployment rate is low, employment rate is high, there’s jobs out there, the people can, at good salaries. And I can see it where you have to get people back into the workforce and get them then spending and you have to make things attractive for them. And so you make housing attractive by making it attractive for the seller.
You know, and people don’t want to sell their house because they, if they go to another house, the interest rate is going to be too high and they’re going to have to take a tax, a capital gains tax on the sale of their house. And then you just multiply that for apartment owners and all of a sudden you have gridlock in the economy. And that’s what we’re experiencing right now. We, you know, we have to get the wheels of the economy turning again to make it make sense to get it going and you have to stimulate it.
And there’s a lot of ways to do it. One is spending and the other is to cut interest rates. And so I think we’ve done plenty for spending, not necessarily in the hands of the people who will spend it, but the, the main thing is, is that can be done, is to cut interest rates from the Fed and that will stimulate the economy. It’s, it’s worked in the past and it’ll work again.
So we’ll see what Chairman Powell, you know, says at the end of the month he shouldn’t be making a report. So hopefully he’ll do that. You know, they’re trying to bring home manufacturing. We’ll, we’ll see where that goes. The immigration policy and for employees is it, it’s, you know, not what we want because it’s too draconian in California now. The judge just ruled that you can’t take people and go and arrest them and search them just because they’re the color of their skin or where they live or what they do. So you, you know, you can’t profile people. So that’s going to slow down this push to, you know, take anybody out of the country that is, regardless of whether or not they’ve committed a crime.
But just because of the, the papers they have are only temporary, right?
Bert Martinez:
I mean, and look what’s happening. So we’ve, so far, we’ve had several US citizens that have been detained, arrested, whatever the correct term is. We have another gentleman who has five kids, he’s been married, they went to visit Canada, and he was not allowed back in because when he was in his 20s, he committed a couple of, I consider. Mr. You know, small crimes, right? I think it was driving with a suspended driver’s license and there was a marijuana conviction, which I don’t think should even stay on his record. But bottom line is he paid off everything. He hasn’t committed a crime since. But yet they won’t allow him to come back in the States.
They, they told him, if you try to come back in, we’re going to detain you. And, and this is the kind of stuff that is unnecessary. It’s, it’s one thing if you are detaining and, and deporting people who are here illegally who have committed crimes ser, you know, real crimes, and, and they’re currently active, I guess, in committing those crimes.
But when you’re looking at somebody and they, when you look at somebody who, who hasn’t committed a crime in over 30 years, and you know, again, these are crimes that, that are, are very common among young, inexperienced people. And, and so you’re, you’re, you know, there’s no point, you’re not achieving any kind of, you’re not helping the US in any way. And, and so this is one of the things that, that hopefully the administration will be able to figure out in a timely way. And, and the way I see it, it’s just going to cause more chaos and turmoil and more money because you, you deport some of these people and let’s say that 80% of them are here undocumented. Great.
What about that 20%? You have lawsuits that are going to be filed. The DOJ is going to have to work more and you’re not saving any money, you’re not making things better. But it’s, it’s, it’s great for headlines and it’s great for those people who feel disenfranchised with, with their particular life and they feel as though, man, by getting rid of some of these immigrants, my life is somehow going to be better. It’s not going to be better. It’s, it’s going to be exactly the same because you’re focused on the wrong thing. And, and, and I think that it’s going to be interesting to see what Chairman Powell does because I think he’s already, at least, I think last week he stated, we’re not doing anything right now. So I’m, I’m eager to see. I think everybody’s kind of holding their breath to see what he does.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, it’s that, that’s, you know, two parts, two blocks sides of the, of the sword. You know, the immigration. I think people, I don’t, I was just studying it, so I have a little better understanding. There’s Biden, for the most part, the people that he let into the country were on temporary visas from countries where there was persecution. So the best example would be Afghanistan. There’s people in this country who helped the Americans when we were there and they had to leave because they, they would have been jailed and life would be, was threatened because they helped the Americans. But before the Taliban took over. Right.
So they all came to this country under visas. What the administration is doing is, is it’s canceling those visas for our allies. These are our friends. And that’s a mistake. And there’s a lot of, of issues with cancellation of these visas. And there has to be an examination of, you know, has this person committed a crime? You know, they should or should their, their visa be revoked? If not, let it be. And so, and these people have jobs and if they, I think they feel like they’re not going to be profiled and, and taken away, they’ll be out spending money and working in this society. And those, that group is a completely separate group from people who have crossed the border illegally.
And that is, you know, they came through the fence. And that group has no right to be in the country legally. They can, you know, then petition for asylum, but that generally has not worked because the administration takes the view that you committed a crime when you cross the border. But that’s not the biggest group. The biggest group actually are here legally on temporary visas. So the question are student visas or tourist visas? Right. And so they, some have overstayed their welcome, some haven’t. But we need to get the issues resolved as to, you know, you can’t profile, number one. And number two, you don’t go after people like some woman showed up for her hearing.
She’s been in the country for over 40 years and they arrested her because she overstayed her visa. Well, I mean, that’s, you know, what has she done during that time? No crimes. Clean record shows up every time for her hearing. Periodically they want to know if she’s still here and what she’s doing. And so it’s a self defeating process because these people are already here, they’re productive, they’re doing jobs and it has to be a one by one situation and you can clean it up because the, the administration, to their credit, has closed the borders and that was what got the president elected. People wanted the borders closed. They didn’t necessarily want law abiding citizens to be arrested and sent back to a country where they, where they came from, especially when they’re facing persecution if they go there.
Bert Martinez:
Yeah, absolutely. And, and, and what’s interesting to me is, and something that, that kind of reminds me that this administration does not understand or doesn’t care about friendship or loyalty. Right. They’re not into that. They are not going to reciprocate any kind of, I don’t know, decency because like you said, here are these, these people who put their necks on the line against the Taliban. They were promised that they could relocate here. And now this administration saying, oh, that doesn’t count. That was, that was somebody else’s deal, it wasn’t our deal.
And, and it’s, those kind of things are unnecessary. There is so much, there is so much that, that can be done for good. Why, why are they going after, like you said, law abiding allies. Why are you going after people that are trying to do the right thing? What is the point of arresting a lady who is showing up to her immigration appointment? It’s, it just, you know, it to me. Immigration could have sent her a letter and saying, hey, you’re out of time. We’re going to give you 30 days to pack up and leave. Then if she didn’t do that, that’s when you arrest her. But again, she’s showing up to her appointments, she’s trying to do the legal thing.
And what good, what value is being delivered by arresting her at her appointments? All it’s doing is scaring everybody else who’s trying to do it legally.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah. And you know, we talk about spending money and the velocity of money. No one’s going to spend money knowing that they may be evicted from the country to points unknown. Right. They’re picked up off the street. Some lady was doing her gardening and they picked her up out of her garden and put her in a prison that they, the family, can’t find out where she is. You know, this is no due process at all and it’s not a way to handle it. And it doesn’t help the economy.
All it does is, is make things worse because no one’s going to spend any money in a system like that. And no, there’s people that just aren’t going to do these jobs, the farm jobs, the meat packing jobs, the, you know, get your hands dirty jobs, the construction jobs. You’re just not gonna, landscaping jobs. You’re just not going to have the personnel to do it. And then it grinds to a halt. It’s the same thing. So the, every, the administration should be looking at this on a one by one situation. And people that, you know, have committed crimes that, you know, of course they should give in due process, but then relocated and not in some unknown facility the middle of the Everglades. I mean, it’s, that’s no, no process at all.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely. And, and, and again, I, I think that this is not the first administration that has done mass deportation. Of course, President Trump wants to do the biggest, you know, and, and every time they deport somebody and makes a headline because that’s what some of his cons, a lot of his constituents want. That right.
What’s interesting to me, and I’ve mentioned this before, 60 Minutes has done a report saying that 20% of the people coming over the fence here illegally are Chinese. I think that’s, to me, scarier than having a person who’s coming over here to pick crops and do some menial labor type stuff. I think that the administration needs to focus on what is it that’s going to help the economy, how do we get more jobs? And, and, and it’s, I, I’m all for getting more jobs here and getting more manufacturing here, but here’s my question to you, Norm. Let’s say that again.
They bring a bunch of manufacturing here, it’s going to be more expensive. Are US Citizens so patriotic that they’re going to pay two or three times what they’re paying now for a shirt because it’s made in the U.S. i don’t think so. What’s your thoughts?
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, you know, it’s an interesting question because are they going to pay more if they don’t have to? Of course not. But the question is when you, they come over and there’s a tax on it, a tariff, they don’t call it a tax. A tariff on it that increases the price of the product coming in. At the same time the US Manufacturer is going to increase their price or vice versa. So if a product comes in from a foreign country with a tariff on it, that tariff is going to be put into the cost of goods sold. And basically the competition will increase the price the same way. Right. So I think all it does is increase the price across the board, you know, and if the manufacturer overseas absorbs the cost, then I assume that the US Manufacturer will also absorb the cost of.
We don’t know the answer to that question because it hasn’t developed yet. You know, expect that Nike shoes are going to be more expensive. So, you know, that’s. And the question is, who eats the, the tariff? We don’t know the answer to that.
Bert Martinez:
Right. And one of the other things that, that, all of this chaos and fear that again, back to the, the, the immigration folks, you know, they started raiding farms. Talk about shooting the, you know, shooting the economy. If, if those farms aren’t able to get their crops to market, they’re going to sit there and rot. We’ve had that before during the first Trump administration. Secondly, that means that your produce prices are going to go up. So again, you’re not helping the economy if these immigrant workers aren’t there to pick the crops. Again, last time this happened with the Trump administration, there wasn’t anybody who was willing to pick those crops.
And I think at one point the farmers were paying like 30 or 40 bucks an hour and they still couldn’t get anybody to come pick crops.
Norm Blumenthal:
No, it’s a backbreaking job. There’s a good decision out of California. It only applies to Southern California under the new rules where you can’t profile. Like when they raided those cannabis farms and everybody was running, you can’t profile, say, okay, if you’re somebody handling crops on a farm, you’re probably illegal. So they go and start chasing down people to look for their papers. You can’t do that. You have to have probable cause to stop and question them. And the fact that they may, their skin may be brown and they’re working on a cannabis farm, that’s profiling.
That’s illegal. So if you make it one on one, you’re way better off going to universities, too. There’s a big business in educating foreigners in this country with student visas. And the universities, it’s a, a good profit center for them because they pay, you know, top dollar for the education. What’s wrong with that? You know, they’re not taking anybody’s spaces on there because this is a different system. You know, in California, you’re in the top 5%. You go to the top 5% of schools, Berkeley or UCLA or, you know, or UCSD. So it, it all evens out in the end.
But people have to spend money. And the problem we have here is the administration’s thought on how it’s going to get the debt paid for is by stimulating the economy, which is good, but you can’t stimulate the economy when people are out there worrying about whether or not they’re going to get arrested.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely correct. And, and again, let’s look at things historically. We, for the most part, we have not had problems with the immigrant worker. You know, yeah, some of them get drunk and get rowdy, but, you know, that’s, in my opinion, isn’t that bad. But, and, and yes, look, I, I, I’ll tell you a really funny story here. So I was at a red light and this, I was. So it was me and another gentleman, and we’re both the two first cars at the red light. And somehow this car came out of nowhere and smashed in between us, damaging my vehicle a little bit and, and damaging the other person’s vehicle a lot.
And what had happened? It was an undocumented person gentleman, and he had fallen asleep at the wheel. He had, he had overworked and fell asleep at the wheel. The police were there and we go through all this stuff and, you know, information exchanges hands and, and the police come to me, and this is in Houston, Texas. The police come to me and say, hey, do you want me to arrest this guy or let him go? I said, no. I said, you know, I, I appreciate the fact what he’s doing, but he, he didn’t have insurance, he had no id. He was here illegally. It’s like, no, let him spend a night in jail. So maybe he’ll attempt to get insurance, because you can get insurance if, if you want.
It’s called non owners insurance. At least in Houston you can get that or Texas, anyway. So the cop says, man, we really don’t want to arrest him. You know, it’s a lot of paperwork and we’re almost done with our shift. We don’t want to do it. So they didn’t arrest him. And, and I, I think that that is, again, Lacy, lazy policing. I think that if you commit a crime, and again, in this situation, luckily nobody was hurt.
Yeah, some property was damaged. I was okay with the guy spending 24 hours in jail then releasing him, but in this case, he got away with everything. And I think that now we have this pendulum that swung to the other end where they’re looking for anything brown skin, he might be illegal. And, and we’re going to get to the point now that you’re going to have to carry your papers. You’re gonna have to carry your birth certificate or something with you to prove that you’re a U.S. citizen. You’re gonna have to, you know, you’re gonna have to have something on you because let me tell you, if I was at one of these farms when they did a raid, they would have probably hauled me away too. I fit that description.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah. It’s hard, it’s hard to know the. Well, the good news is that the border is closed. You know, that’s the good news. Yes. So if you’re a U. S. Citizen and you cross the border, make sure you have your, your birth certificate or your passport with you.
Otherwise you’re, you’re not getting in. So they had, and they have plenty of money to cover the borders. So then you’re dealing with a finite set of people that are here. And if they’re arrested for a crime, there should be, or there is a crime, there should be a database to whether or not they have the proper papers. If they don’t, then they need due process and they, and sent to, back to the country of origin. That’s where you go. Unless there’s some asylum law that’s in effect that allows them to stay. Right.
And, or they have papers, you know, student visa, tourist visa, a visa that allows them to stay. After that, you know, as the visas run out, you’ll have less and less people that are here illegally and they’re not crossing the border illegally. And all they’re doing is overstaying their visa, which may require them to get it renewed. And that’s all part of the process and it keeps the economy going. The idea of taking people off their workforce is a mistake. Have plenty of jobs that no one wants to do that. There’s people there that’ll do it if they were given the opportunity.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely. And, and again, the, the, the, the biggest, biggest mistake that the administration is making is avoiding the due process. I, I think that’s just going to come back and, and, and bite them in the butt on so many different ways. It’s, there’s going to be an increased cost. Of course. You know, we have a new, we have a supreme court that is.
Would say, seems to follow the, the MAGA mindset. Not all the time, but at least 50% of the time. So maybe they’ll write some new laws that, that says, hey, probable cause is unnecessary anymore. Who knows what they’re going to come up with. But bottom line is probable cause is important. Due process, Due processes is the most important Thing I think that you got to give people a chance to go to court and explain their situation and show the evidence that they’re here legally or here illegally. And then if they’re here illegally, you want to terminate their stay, then do that. And, and as you mentioned earlier, that.
Then the other thing is, can we do it in a way that doesn’t hurt people? So to send somebody for no reason to some prison in El Salvador because you think they’re here illegally or you think they’re part of a gang, then again, how is that helping the U.S. it’s not really helping the U.S. you can say, oh, we got some. We got some bad people off the street. So crime is going down. Crime is still not going down. It’s going to make a, maybe a blip in that area. But bottom line is, I think that we, as the US we have a duty to make sure that not only are we following the law, but that if this person, if we deport this person to their, their orig.
Their home. Yeah. Their, their place of origin, they may be killed or tortured, then let’s do the right thing and deport them someplace else.
Norm Blumenthal:
Well, the biggest problem is is this idea of picking somebody up off the street and not. They’re not. They don’t get a phone call to get an attorney or tell their family where they are.
Bert Martinez:
Right.
Norm Blumenthal:
They’re in limbo. And, you know, people are never return from these gulags. I mean, it’s basically, is what it is. There’s no due process, there’s no information. You arrest a person, they should be entitled to a phone call and tell them where they are.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely. It’s. It’s such a basic thing to do. It doesn’t hurt them. It doesn’t cost any real money. And then the other thing that I find a little appalling, and I want to get your take on this, Norm, is we now see a bunch of these police officers who are wearing masks. And, and I just find that to be suspicious. What’s your take on that?
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, my. I have the same take. I think that they should have identified themselves not necessarily with their name, but there has to be some identification numbers on them that you can verify. They can veri. You can verify that this, this number matches a person who is employed by ICE so that you’re not dealing with some rogue impersonator.
Bert Martinez:
Right.
Norm Blumenthal:
That’s. That’s what I object to because anybody could put a mask on and a badge. I mean, they sell these things, I guess, at these gun shows or whatever. And so they can impersonate an officer, and there’s no way to know because you can’t check.
Bert Martinez:
Right.
Norm Blumenthal:
And so there’s no accountability. And that’s, you know, then, now that now you’re into the realm of the police state.
Bert Martinez:
Right. And, and look, nobody, Nobody likes to be held accountable. But accountability does make us better. It helps to help us all to perform better. And, and, and whether in your family setting, work setting, or, or any place else, we have to hold each other accountable. And, and you got a police officer who’s unidentifiable. You don’t know. You don’t know what branch he works for.
You don’t know anything about his name or any way identifying him. And so to me, that seems unlawful. It seems like almost the opposite of, of, of what the police should be like. And look, I understand that in some cases, you have to hide that police officer or law enforcement person’s identity to an extent, but like you said, there could be a number on his vest, some kind of way of saying, hey, this officer with whatever number xyz, you know, needs to be investigated. They, you know, they need to be held accountable. You know, let’s do that. But when they all look the same and their, and their faces are covered, I think we’re, we’re on a. What do they saw? What did they say? A slippery slope.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, the, you know, this whole idea of profiling has to go away and due process has to be brought back, and you have to have a probable cause. When you take somebody and ask them for ID that, that they, if they can’t produce it, then you put them in a gulag. That’s not what America is all about. Right.
Bert Martinez:
And so let me give you, let me ask you this, Norm. Here we are, we’re on the seventh month of the Trump administration. Do you see any light at the end of the tunnel?
Norm Blumenthal:
You know, hope springs eternal from an economic standpoint. Bassett, Treasury Secretary, has his finger on the pulse of things that can be done to stimulate the economy. So I think, you know, reducing interest rates, making loans, sales of homes and apartments without any taxes on it, stimulate that economy. And to a large extent. So I think the economy will be stimulated then. I think the borders are secure. Now it’s just a question of people in this country that we don’t want to stay here. I mean, they have to have probable cause to want to remove them.
You know, and it’s. If they come in here illegally, that’s cause for removal. If they’ve committed a crime that’s cause for removal. So they have overstayed their welcome. That’s cause for removal. But there has to be a way that they can cure that and still stay here. And that’s what we need to emphasize. And so we get everybody back on the same page and have them spend money, not be afraid to go, to go out and go to a bar and enjoy themselves and stimulate the economy and keep everybody working and spending.
That’s what we have to do. Velocity of money is the key to the kingdom.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely. When you look back at what made America strong was that velocity of money, innovation, putting more and more people to work, inn, and, and we see it all through history from the industrial age all the way up to today. You see that, that the pie just kept getting bigger and bigger and, and people were finding not only good jobs, but there was a variety of jobs that they could attain. I think that one of the other things that, that people are concerned with, Norm, is AI shrinking that pie a little bit because it looks like AI is going to be here forever and it’s going to definitely take some jobs.
Norm Blumenthal:
Well, I think it’ll create jobs too. I look at it, you know, everybody thought, oh, when we had the Internet, you know, this is going to take away everybody’s job. And it took away a lot of jobs, but created a lot of jobs.
Bert Martinez:
And that’s a good point. I mean, I remember that with the, with the auto industry when they started using those robots, people, some people did lose their jobs, but guess what? Other people found jobs repairing those robots and making those robots, you know, being able to program those robots. So you’re right there. Is that, that, that other side of the coin?
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, I think that you’re going to see that. And I think again, that’s just a, a step in progress. But at the end of the day, I cannot do what people advertise it would do, which is reason. And it can’t reason. It can give you data and you can ask questions. And it’s like, you know, when I was a kid, the World Book, you had you look it up. Or Encyclopedia Britannica. Yeah, this is just a big encyclopedia that you have and you can look it up, but it’s not going to be able to reason and say, oh, this is the answer to solving the pollution problem.
You’re not going to get that. You can’t reason. It can only give you data. And if the, if the information is not in the data bank, then you’re not going to get it out. And so there’s a step, you know, maybe quantum mechanics will cross over that step. But right now, we’re not there yet. There’s still another, at least one more level of progress that we have to make on what we have. And so, you know, it’s, I’m hopeful that we’ll keep going and, you know, we get everybody back on the same page.
I think there’s a chance that we can do that and, and hopefully it’ll, it’ll happen in a reasonably short period of time.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely. And I like your take on that, reminding us that, yeah, AI is not foolproof. It doesn’t reason. Look at all the people who’ve gotten in trouble relying on AI for their paper. Or just recently, several lawyers were fined $3,000 because. Not because they used AI because, but because they relied on AI to be accurate. And it turned out that either all or 80% of the case law that they cited was completely made up. Factitious, hallucinations, whatever you want to call them.
So AI, it’s a step up from Internet, from the Internet to an extent. But like you said, it doesn’t reason. It doesn’t know when it, when it’s wrong or doesn’t know when it’s giving you wrong information based on the data. So we still got some, some wiggle room there. But overall, I think that today’s takeaway is just getting the velocity of money. Cranking the velocity of money is really going to help out so many of us, but unfortunately, a lot of people are afraid to spend money.
Norm Blumenthal:
Yeah, that’s. You got to get everybody off the sidelines and back in the game. And you have to make it where they’re comfortable playing. And you can’t have people hiding out in their homes in fear of being deported. You know, you can’t, you can’t do it. It’s not going to work. And you end up with less and less velocity.
Bert Martinez:
Absolutely, Norm. On that note, we’re going to end. As always, my friends, good to have you here and we’ll talk to you soon.
Norm Blumenthal:
Thanks, Bert. Always a pleasure. Take care.
Bert Martinez:
Good stuff there from Norm Blumenthal. Norm Blumenthal is a lawyer who represents working class people like you and I. He really loves to champion the underdog. And I, I love Norm. He is, he’s one of those lawyers that has a lot of heart and, and he really can empathize with the, the struggles that we all deal with. So if you have questions about Norm Blumenthal, you can reach out to him at BAM Law ca. That’s B as in Bravo Alpha, Mary Bam Law ca and share this episode with everyone you know. Let’s get the conversation started.
I’m not talking about hate. I’m talking about an intelligent conversation. Tell me what you think. Did we get some stuff right? Are we 100 wrong? Drop your drop your comments in the comments and let’s get the conversation started. As always, my friends, thank you for being here. Remember, you were created to succeed.
